Test equipment

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Subject Author Date
Test equipment Padu 08-04-2005
---> Re: Test equipment The Artist Form ..08-05-2005
Posted by Padu on August 4, 2005, 7:54 pm
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Apologies if this topic was asked before.

I've finished the mechanical phase of my mobile robot. Now I'm gonna start
the electronics phase. I know that some test tools are fundamental for
debugging and testing. I have limited access to oscopes here at the company
that I work for, but I realize that it would be more convenient if I had one
at home.

I'll be working with RS485 a lot, so I guess a logic analyzer would be good
too.


Now, with all this info, plus the fact that I'm not a professional electr.
engineer, do you think something like this would suffice?

USBee SX
http://www.usbee.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=22&HS=1

For a little bit more, I could buy a used analog tektronix oscope (around
$500), but still too expensive for me... $300 is my limit.
Should I just give up? Any other ideas?

Padu



Posted by MetalHead on August 5, 2005, 1:04 am
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Padu wrote:
> Now, with all this info, plus the fact that I'm not a professional electr.
> engineer, do you think something like this would suffice?
>
> USBee SX
> http://www.usbee.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=22&HS=1
>
> For a little bit more, I could buy a used analog tektronix oscope (around
> $500), but still too expensive for me... $300 is my limit.
> Should I just give up? Any other ideas?

A Logic Analyzer is really useful for certain tasks, but for my money, a
basic o'scope is a required piece of equipment. My thoughts on order of
electronic tool purchase based on how often I use them are:

A simple set of good quality hand tools

A good soldering iron

Good desoldering tools.

Digital Volt/Ohm meter

O'Scope

Logic Analyzer

I believe strongly in buying good tools and taking care of them. They
will last a long time and not be a pain to use.

Soldering iron. Doesn't have to be an electonic temp controlled one,
just not a $3.95 piece of crap that overheats and burns the tinning off
the tip in minutes. Coated tips are a good sign. A decent iron in the
10-20 Watt range with a sponge to clean the tip on should be in the
$20-$30US range.

Desoldering tools. Can be as simple as solder wick. The blue or maybe
silver "Soldapullt" solder suckers are an excellent investment.

Digital Volt/Ohm meter. Personal preference goes a long way here, there
are many decent meters on the market from about $30US up to several
hundred dollars. Myself, I hate autoranging meters because I am always
waiting for them to find the right range before they tell you what you
wanted to know. Many people seem to like them.

O'scope. Analog scopes work well for most of what I want a scope for.
Once in a while a digital scope would be nice - they show certain types
of problems very well, but I still don't have one yet. Scopes are rated
by their maximum frequency. Analog scopes will actually show higher
frequencies than their rated top end but the amplitude accuracy suffers.
If you are looking to see if a fast CPU bus bit is wiggling, an analog
scope will show you. Digital scopes will lie to you if you exceed their
sample frequency/2. They require some care in general use to be sure you
really are seeing what is there. A new analog, 20MHz dual trace Asian
scope can probably be had for about $400US. An old Tektronix 465 100Mhz
dual trace analog scope can probably be had in the $150US range. The Tek
465 is a really fine scope within it's capabilities. The Tek 2465 scopes
are really nice but as you say in the $500 - 800 range.

Logic analyzers. There are many choices depending on how fast, how deep
and how many channels you want. Some problems require a logic
analyzer, but not that many home type project ones do in my experience.

I am sure other people will add stuff I have forgotten or disagree with
some comments. Some of the choices depend on exactly what you are doing
at home.

Good Luck,
Bob

Posted by Too_Many_Tools on August 5, 2005, 7:27 am
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Good reply....does anyone have suggests for a further suggestions?

One question I would have is what logic analyzers are available to
amateur robotic builders from the used market?

TMT



Posted by Padu on August 5, 2005, 2:48 pm
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"MetalHead"

> A Logic Analyzer is really useful for certain tasks, but for my money, a
> basic o'scope is a required piece of equipment. My thoughts on order of
> electronic tool purchase based on how often I use them are:
>
> A simple set of good quality hand tools
>
> A good soldering iron
>
> Good desoldering tools.
>
> Digital Volt/Ohm meter
>
> O'Scope
>
> Logic Analyzer
>
> I believe strongly in buying good tools and taking care of them. They will
> last a long time and not be a pain to use.
>
> Soldering iron. Doesn't have to be an electonic temp controlled one, just
> not a $3.95 piece of crap that overheats and burns the tinning off the tip
> in minutes. Coated tips are a good sign. A decent iron in the 10-20 Watt
> range with a sponge to clean the tip on should be in the $20-$30US range.
>
> Desoldering tools. Can be as simple as solder wick. The blue or maybe
> silver "Soldapullt" solder suckers are an excellent investment.
>
> Digital Volt/Ohm meter. Personal preference goes a long way here, there
> are many decent meters on the market from about $30US up to several
> hundred dollars. Myself, I hate autoranging meters because I am always
> waiting for them to find the right range before they tell you what you
> wanted to know. Many people seem to like them.
>
> O'scope. Analog scopes work well for most of what I want a scope for. Once
> in a while a digital scope would be nice - they show certain types of
> problems very well, but I still don't have one yet. Scopes are rated by
> their maximum frequency. Analog scopes will actually show higher
> frequencies than their rated top end but the amplitude accuracy suffers.
> If you are looking to see if a fast CPU bus bit is wiggling, an analog
> scope will show you. Digital scopes will lie to you if you exceed their
> sample frequency/2. They require some care in general use to be sure you
> really are seeing what is there. A new analog, 20MHz dual trace Asian
> scope can probably be had for about $400US. An old Tektronix 465 100Mhz
> dual trace analog scope can probably be had in the $150US range. The Tek
> 465 is a really fine scope within it's capabilities. The Tek 2465 scopes
> are really nice but as you say in the $500 - 800 range.
>
> Logic analyzers. There are many choices depending on how fast, how deep
> and how many channels you want. Some problems require a logic analyzer,
> but not that many home type project ones do in my experience.
>
> I am sure other people will add stuff I have forgotten or disagree with
> some comments. Some of the choices depend on exactly what you are doing at
> home.
>
> Good Luck,
> Bob


Thanks for the reply Bob.

My company has a few Tek 465B not being used right now because they are
broken. They just sit there. I'm thinking if it would be cheaper for me to
buy a 465 of EBay as tAfkaks suggested or to buy one of these broken 465B
and send it to fix somewhere.

Also, I saw one goldstar for sale at Fry's for $365, I believe it is a 20MHz
one. Would you still rather buy a used 100MHz tektronix?

Padu



Posted by The Artist Formerly Known as K on August 5, 2005, 3:19 pm
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Padu wrote:
9>
> Thanks for the reply Bob.
>
> My company has a few Tek 465B not being used right now because they are
> broken. They just sit there. I'm thinking if it would be cheaper for me to
> buy a 465 of EBay as tAfkaks suggested or to buy one of these broken 465B
> and send it to fix somewhere.
>
> Also, I saw one goldstar for sale at Fry's for $365, I believe it is a 20MHz
> one. Would you still rather buy a used 100MHz tektronix?
>
> Padu
>
>

Personally, I'd go for the higher rate. Note that with a 20mhz scope,
you won't be able to get much detail on a 20mhz signal.
--
(Replies: cleanse my address of the Mark of the Beast!)

Teleoperate a roving mobile robot from the web:
http://www.swampgas.com/robotics/rover.html

Coauthor with Dennis Clark of "Building Robot Drive Trains".
Buy several copies today!

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